Tug Forum

Specialist Types Of Tug Boat => Pusher Tugs => : gregk9 April 25, 2010, 01:31:05

: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 April 25, 2010, 01:31:05
Ive just bought a set of plans for one of these Pusher Tugs, its one of those with an elevating control cabin [scissor system], Fancied having a go at scratchbuilding from flat pack. has anyone built one of these, could do with some hints and tips, also some decent photo's would not go amiss before I start.

Also, would it be better to go for a ply hull and deck, then build the upperworks from plasticard, or simply to go for a full plastic build. Plastic's no problem to me, used to working with the stuff, but wondering about hull strength and rigidity, especiually if I ever fancied a tug barge competition with it.

Its something to build once my Sun tug is completed, I always like to look ahead to next challenge !
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: tugs53 April 25, 2010, 10:29:00
That will be a first here on this forum....I think ??? ???


Looking forward to reading about the build :) :) cool cool
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: Sudbury II April 25, 2010, 17:36:33
Can't wait to read the build thread!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Suds
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 April 26, 2010, 00:53:06
OH DEAR ! :o

Does this mean I'm the gunnea pig on this creation?

"I've created a monsta !" :o

Aaaarrggghhhh .........

Lets just hope the bounce does not go from my Bungee............. well not before completion anyway. ;D


Incidentally , some of the "model pic's" i'm using at present are from a build blog, created and built by Scottie @ marine-moddeling.co.uk.
Appologies to moderators if you dislike people giving out "plugs", but untill I start the build, I have nothing to show what I'm going on about.

Ta.

But if anyone does read this thread with any info or pictures, I'd appreciate anything sent in or commented.
i'm already building up a small data bank of pictures and other peoples build details, so has "somethuing" from which to read and assist me with.
I have some ideas and suggestions  concerning the "bridge lift servo" and to use a "sail winch servo" [for the added torque required to lift the bridge weight], but the "radar drive" [as I intend to rotate both radar scanners too] is tasking some deliverance, some peoples ideas of "band drive2 has failed, so i'm now thinking along single layer gear drive, using some lightweigth plastic gears and brass centre posts, but again, all this weight has to be lifted by the servo. Its not so bad on the "down", good old gravity will assist no doubts here.......
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: thelongbuild April 26, 2010, 04:25:37
Should be an intersting build, I have only see this model once elsewhere.
do you have the backing articles with the plans as this was covered over 4 months may to August 1988 in model boats..if not I might be able to help.

Funny enough I recently sold this plan as well , but don't think it was you..
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 April 26, 2010, 04:29:35
Yes, the boat plans I bought, did come with a photocopy of the original building logs from the 4 issues of the magazine, I purchased off Ebay last week, dont worry if it was you who sold them, I have no problem with that, I'm just merely collecting more info to assist in the build before I commence the order for sticking plasters and paracetamol [again]. ;D
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: thelongbuild April 26, 2010, 05:03:39
No wasn't me , wish it had been , me thinks me be underchargeing  :(  , looking at what that seller is charging for basic plans , but still afair price I would say.

: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 April 26, 2010, 15:32:17
Have  done a bit of digging today and after reading the "model boat build" and their offer of a "styrene build pack", decided to give them a call, on the off chance they actually may well have one knocking around on the bottom of a rather dusty shelf!

Answer, YES ! price had gone up a bit since the plans were originally printed [1988], but nevertheless, they had a pack available, but no longer. Hopefully it should be cruising itself my way.  HHmm, back in 1988, they pack was on offer for a mere 18.00, but todays price inc posting was 34.00. I will update once the parcel arrives, cant wait to see what we get for this, perhaps its a semi completed "ARTR" Na, perhaps thats wishful thinking or loosing out on the fun bit of a full build.

I thought it best to try them first, as it seems only a limited number of possibilities to get styrene sheet [in 1 piece lengthways] that is needed for the build. So rather than risk one of my plastic seam joins on the hull sides and bottom, its less chance to risk  a titanic job with a side plate splitting apart on a slight impact.

have been looking at "shottle drives", but perhaps due to cost I may have to resort to swivel korts instead. Coupled with 2 mfa 500/550's should give it the power needed to ease a barge along quite merrily. not quite decided on size of Prop's yet.............. perhaps once the build of the hull begins, I will get a better gauge of what space I have to squeeze some power plant in..
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: thelongbuild April 27, 2010, 03:50:33
re The pack , Just shows Don't ask Don't get..  Nice one.. Bet they had to go rummaging in the vaults for that one 22yrs on... 
: Ikea delivery !
: gregk9 April 30, 2010, 02:16:08
Ok, SO my delivery from "Ikea", er, sorry ! Model Boats has arrived,strangely it arrived via a  Sub contractor/supplier and not directly "off the shelf".

Ive opened the flat pack and checked its contents and it looks like all that was originally statedf in the original build plans from the magazine are here. Unfortunately, the magazine never did print an "itinery list [as such]" for the available kit and the "subby" has neglected to do so either, apart from having their address details, so I can go direct [hopefully] if I need any more "longer " lengths of styrene sheet, remembering that the hull sides on this pusher tug model are 27" long [675mm].  I hope you appreciate that usual stockists of styrene sheet sell "A4" size, so without wanting to "join" 3 sheets together, this was an oppertunity not to miss out on.

I have my Sun Tug to complete first, so I will post on here once that is finished. This is a project that may well require my full attention, especially if contstructing the hull in styrene sheet !
I still yet may opt for Ply and build the basic hull shell from 1.5mm ply skins, not yet decided.................
: Pictures of "Ikea Pack "
: gregk9 April 30, 2010, 02:20:01
Sorry, forgot to attach pictures of pack contents.
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: Umi_Ryuzuki April 30, 2010, 10:04:21
You might find a bit of comeraderie with this gentleman...

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1226340

:)
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: Red_Hamish May 01, 2010, 11:58:29
Hello all, if anyone else is considering doing one of these great looking (in my eyes) boats, you might want to look to these people for larger than normal (56x26") plastic sheet off the shelf.

http://www.modellersmate.co.uk/plasticard.htm

cheers

Jim
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: pobolycwm May 02, 2010, 00:52:45
looks like a nice set of plans looking forward to this build
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: Gramps May 02, 2010, 12:21:01
re The pack , Just shows Don't ask Don't get..  Nice one.. Bet they had to go rummaging in the vaults for that one 22yrs on...

I doubt it, MB hulls and building packs are available all the time  ???

http://www.myhobbystore.co.uk/product/18077/egret-hull-hulmm1417 (http://www.myhobbystore.co.uk/product/18077/egret-hull-hulmm1417)

http://www.myhobbystore.co.uk/browser/347/boat-hulls# (http://www.myhobbystore.co.uk/browser/347/boat-hulls#)
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: tugs53 May 02, 2010, 12:32:22
This is interesting...seeing as we're at that site for the moment...

http://www.myhobbystore.co.uk/product/18069/keenoma-hull-hulmm1322
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 May 02, 2010, 14:01:28
WELL !

So called "my hobby store2 certanly got this one completely wrong!

i ordered the styrene pack  "as described and with reference number" in their write up, pack arrived, as I previously showed pictures of, but after reading the instructions twice, the styrene pack they sent is all WRONG SIZE ! Instead of sending 1mm 1.5mm 2mm and a sheet of .75mm, they have sent 10thou, 15thou, 20 thou ! And HOW may i ask are you supposed to build a hull capable of supporting its size.
/weight out of this?

I'll have to wait untill the shop opens again on tuesday morning before making a call to see what they are prepared to do to remedy the situation.

Obviously someone has misread the kit contents list and read imperial instead of metric! [ I HOPE] !

No body is perfect!


Oh, recieved my copy of the "commemorative special issue". Tobe honest guys, its not worth the "hype", keep your money and just buy the monthly mag. Its all bits n pieces from old issues, and not enough of any one subject to make a full story, its all "recaps" so to speak.
: Hull kit update !
: gregk9 May 04, 2010, 10:59:43
tried time after time today to get through to "my hobby store", till I almost flattened the battery in my phone handset!, time after time I was placed on "call waiting", so gave up in the end and  contacted the "sub contractor/supplier" who actually sent the styrene pack out to me. the guy at the other end of the phone was very freindly and appologised for the error of wrongly supplied sheet thickness and has promised to put the correct thickness sheets in the post to me, to replace the hull sides and base. 1.5mm is thin enough to use for the hull sides, let alone the 0.85mm they actually sent!

It goes to show that when ordering these hull kits, please check the contents fully and make sure that not just the length/width is ok, but make sure the sheets are correct thickness for their specific purpose too!

I did eventually get through to "my hobby store" and explained my problem, they too were appologetic, but I tried my best to explain tot hem, is the problem in the "cut list" supplied to the sub contractor or was it simply the sub contractor cutting all the panels from one sheet of styrene?

WHO KNOWS ?

I will await yet another delivery from ikea !
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 May 05, 2010, 07:20:40
Flat pack parcel arrived this morning!
Complete with the replacement styrene sheets [of correct thickness!].

So, back on track once my Sun tug is complete, but if anyone reading this blog has and details, pictures or suggestions for suitable motors/props/ kort sizes, id greatly appreciate it. :D
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: Gramps May 05, 2010, 13:30:18
I've tried a couple of their hulls and they're fairly good. I've often thought about Keenoma, it looks quite a nice tug from the drawing, has anyone built one?
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 May 05, 2010, 13:46:46
please remember this is not a "full hull" as such, its only sheets of styrene card which have to be cut and joined, its not pre formed in any way.

As for the other one you mentioned, perhaps you need to ask about this on the open forum, not on this blog, as I was trying to keep this one for a specific build.
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: Gramps May 06, 2010, 11:37:20
Woa, you're moderating the moderators?  :o
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 May 06, 2010, 14:22:40
I was merely pointing out that your request for info would be better suited on the open forum, where you would stand a better chance of a reply with the info you need, rather than on this one.

perhaps sometimes things like this need pointing out to some people, as I started this off to get info for my project before I start building it, not to go off at a tangent just because someone decides to take it over and throw all their toys out of the pram.

Moderator or not, there is no need to get funny, nor to start using your title as leverage. thats not my fault !
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: Gramps May 07, 2010, 11:56:43
PM sent
: Powertrain update.
: gregk9 May 13, 2010, 07:19:42
I've taken the plunge and mad a decision. I have gone for swivelling Kort nozzles [50mm] and 3 blade propellers to match. I will use L/H & R/H prop's to stop the risk of "torque steer" when under power.Still not made my nind up with motors yet, but the more i think about it, the more the MFA 500 series seem to be the most suitable, especially withthe 6:1 ratio gearboxes to reduce rpm's and increase torque for the size of props in use........

Not unless anyone can think of anything more suitable of course? 
: drive train arrived.
: gregk9 May 14, 2010, 04:39:38
just recieved the kort's and propellers today, along with the propeller shafts. Just needing motors and drivetrain will be complete. But as stated previously, im still undecided on motors and would appreciate any tips on these.

the kort nozzles come with fitting instructions as normal supplied parts from Robbe, usually do, but they give no measurements about propeller position, ok, so it goes centrally to the doameter of the kort tube, but how far in/out of the tube does the prop actually sit?
I think I may have to make a wooden "mock up" first and conduct a few trials to get the best position to allow for maximum thrust and also for maximum steering angle permissible.
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: mike_victoriabc May 14, 2010, 06:25:18
Those look like they should be more than adequate for that hull shape - a Springer with twin props in effect.
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 May 14, 2010, 07:05:05
Oh yes, they should provide more than enough pushing power. i did think about putting a bow thruster in as well as, but dropped the idea, as the original didnt have bow thruster, just 2 korts.
Just need to find time to make a "test rig" to check out the positioning of the propeller inside the kort, to ensure  it does not clip the blades on turning.
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: Jack Holland May 15, 2010, 08:00:44
Almost the same wheelhouse lifting system in reality.
(http://img683.imageshack.us/img683/949/pieter2212558150510noor.jpg) (http://img683.imageshack.us/i/pieter2212558150510noor.jpg/)

Jack Mulder
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 May 15, 2010, 11:08:03
Thanks for the picture! at least that shows the scissors type mechanism very clearly, although positioned at the sides, rather than underneath the cabin.
Er, would hate to slip whilst walking past that lot though! No signs of any safety fence round those lift arms! [ha ha].
: Parts list update.
: gregk9 June 20, 2010, 07:54:07
I have recently recieved delivery of a pair of radar units for this build, supplied and speedily delivered by "MMB" who advertise on this site.
On opening the packet i find they are suitably mounted on their own pedestals, just like the originals fitted to the Egrete, but being a casr resin item, the pedestals are solid. I did think about simply cutting these off and replacing with a hollow piece of plastruct tubing, but decided to have a go at drilling the originals out, to allo a driveshft to rotate them [from underneath the floor].
I found drilling the cast resin fairly easy to do, providing you constantly keep withdrawing the drill bit and removing the resin swarfe before it builds up too much and causes the drill bit to sieze and break the resin moulding, so please be aware of this if attempting similar yourselves.

I will try driving the radar units via a "geartrain" method as several other methods used on similar models dont seem to last very long and have been steered away from using elastic/rubber bands, as the bridge deck does not have sufficient strength to take the strain applied by  this method. Please remember that the bridge/wheelhouse section does lift/lower, so I have a weight limit to keep near to, so cant over strengthen the deck area too much without putting it over on weight.
yes, I will be using a high torque/sail winch type servo for this operation mode, but its one area that will require some delicate balancing on the scales to get it just right.
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: Umi_Ryuzuki June 22, 2010, 19:30:40
Gizmozone, or some other similar shop may have a nice small
6mm motor and gear box you can use to run your radar.

 ;)

http://www.gizmoszone.com/shopping/agora.cgi?
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 June 23, 2010, 12:33:41
Hi Umi,

many thanks for sending that site link, those micro motors look good and not too badly priced either, especially when you consider how much the gear train kits were going to cost me to run from both radar units, to a centrally mounted motor in the wheelhouse.
So, yep, "you dun gurde" my freind.

many thanks.
: Parts update.
: gregk9 September 14, 2010, 06:50:36
I have managed to secure a couple of minature geared motors for the radar masts, they are 3v dc  and so small in dimensions i should have no problems fitting them vertically on the uprigth radar masts on either side of the main bridge. i had to watch the weight and operating mechanism for these as the main bridge is on a working "scissors" mechanism which raises and lowers the complete bridge and gantry deck. :)

I have also now purchased a couple of drive motors for the propulsion system. they are 6volt, but have 6:1 gear ratio units attached. I hope that these will give sufficient power/torque for the tug. If any of you have used these motors before, let me know if you think they will either "do the job", or should I look for something else with more power.

the tug is still at design stage/ parts aquisition stage at present, so no harm done if Ive got wrong bits so to speak. ;D
: Build pt1
: gregk9 October 18, 2010, 07:57:45
Due to the Sun Tug build nearing a close, its time to kick this build up and get things going. Ok, so its like a bit of multitasking, but i'm not one for starting one build off and simply doing "one at a time", I much prefer the challenge and interest of multiple builds so to speak.

So, initial stage of construction was to check all the drawings, re check the sizes of ALL the plastic sheets I orderd for the construction, to 110% make sure they are correct size and thickness as this biuld does call for a lot of different thicknesses of plastic sheet to carry out the construction.
First stage was to cut out the two side hull plates, allowing extra plastic at the bows to allow for the slight raduis, same applied to the forward hull bottom, an additional 3mm was let in to the dimensions to allow for the upward curve towards the bow.

I have also cut  the angled strengtheners as recommended [60], but a few spares due to the width of the sheet now reveals 64 cut in all, but no doubts I will need more and I'm bound to fit more of these support plates than suggested.
: Build pt2
: gregk9 October 19, 2010, 15:23:44
ive started to form the basic hull bottom together, placing some of the main strengtheners inside, along with all the triangulation pieces to add support where it needs it most [hopefully]. I have also added an extra bit. I have slipped in a piece of 1.5mm ply as a base section for the battery area, to help spread the weight of the power packs a bit more evenly, as this will reduce the need for too much plastic ribs and cross bars to do same job. I have pencilled in the centre lines for the props and motors, just as an "aide memoir", so i dont go sticking any cross strengtheners in their paths!
I will wait untill the rear rudder support plate and hull sides are fully fixed before dry fitting the drive train, so i know the hull is fully square and all the glue has set.  trying to check any of this now wont achieve much as the  hull is still very flexible and dont want to misalign anything in this one.
: Build pt3
: gregk9 October 20, 2010, 13:53:22
Today has consisted of attaching the hull sides and bow plate, stern plate section. I differed from the original plans somewhat, but to basically strengthen areas where it could do with it! I have added some angled plates to the front bow corners, as well as adding a horizontal cross brace behind where the pusher posts will be affixed. Again, to add beef to the bow section when pushing barges and stranded boats in our club pool [ha ha].  I will be adding some more additional plates too, details to follow later. The stern rudder supports have been bonded in, ready to accept the pivot posts for the kort units, again swapped the original 1mm stern rudder plate for a 1.5mm one. hopefully this should prevent any warping under turn load, along with some additional cross bracing supports.
: 1st water tank test
: gregk9 October 24, 2010, 06:10:53
 So, the Pusher tug progresses. I needed to test the integrity of the basic hull before going any further, just so I know all the main joints in the hull plates are sound.  yes, I did have 2 minor leaks, just where the brush on liquid plastic weld hadn't run in to, but a quick dry and reapplication has repaired them.
Then on to an engine test, just to try out the geared motors and korts.  the motors sound sweet and the 60mm props running inside swivelling kort nozzles should see it able to handle most operations it may be called to task for.
I had to add a lot of ballast to drop the hull low enough in the water to submerge the korts, but this dead weight will be replaced as the build continues with the remaining structure, plus proper size 12v batteries, once I know what space i have available for them.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0M9qRgaGlHE[youtube]
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 October 26, 2010, 15:18:49
So, after the first water test, I did find a couple of minor leaks, but "hey", were not all perfect ! [ha ha] it had occurred where the poly glue just hadn't quite run full length along the lower hull seams, but a quick dry off and re application, soon sorted this out.
The next stage was to add some vertical reinforcing struts along both sides of the inner hull. Firstly, to add strength to the hull sides to prevent buckling due to the upper hull weight and secondly, to form a solid platform for the deck, so the deck does not bow or flex once in place.
The rear deck section has also recieved extra strengthener bars at each join line of the angled sections that make up its angular shape. Again bit of "belt n braces", but I dont want to have to take this thing apart, due to split seams later on. id far sooner reinforce now and not have to do so later.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0M9qRgaGlHE
: Build pt4
: gregk9 October 27, 2010, 14:37:54
Now that the pusher posts are firmly set in place, I have now constructed the cable roller sets. there are 4 of these set inbetween the pusher posts. I have alos decided to fit a motorised winch, to power 2 of the cables, so making it easier to hitch and unhitch a barge. YES, I will be having a "go" at making this tug work! I have found a nice suitable winch mechanism, complete with a combination set of gears so you can choose the best matching gear train to suit the rpm's desired for winching purposes, plus it means a nice cute small motor, as the gearing will do all the torque multiplying it needs. Its one of the MFA range, fitted with a 1.5v motor. All i really had to do was fix the drive gear securely enough so it does not slip on the metal drum shaft.
The winch in/out motoring will be controlled by a servo operating 2 micro switches, so will just use one throw of a joystick to operate.
: Build pt5
: gregk9 October 29, 2010, 15:11:12
Construction has now begun on the superstructure and winch room, which as the original instructions mention, are basically 2 boxes, joined together under the wheelhouse/bridge.
Following the degin plans is easy enough, all the parts being flat plats, with cutouts for engine room grilles or windows. The holes drilled in the locations of the doors, so once the doors are fitted, you can still see through the perspex. I took the liberty to add some "cover panels" to the side plates, simply to add detail and interest.  the other points to note are there are 2 escape hatches located at the rear, either side of the winch room cabin.
Due to me alos wanting to fit a powered winch, I fixed the front panel of the winch room wall to the deck, thus allowing the winch cables to run through their allotted hawser ports, I then simply cut 2 sidewall pieces and glued them to the removeable superstructure, so once this is in place, the winch wall looks like one piece, plus gives the strength needed to operate the winches properly.
: Build pt6
: gregk9 October 31, 2010, 03:35:47
Time to have a go at the twin funnels. the original details for these seem to differ, the plans show the funnels simply constructed from flat plasticard, but the actual description in text , goes on to say how the rear funnel vents are made, so much is left to your own design and imagination here, but I did decide to go for the "vented" versions, well it adds just that little bit more details to a somewhat bland looking object.
So the funnels were constructed as per the plans, the exhaust pipes were increased in diameter, for better effect and "looks" and I added the rear vents from some stock 4mm wide plasticard strip.
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: tugs53 October 31, 2010, 14:03:08
Funnel vents are a great detail feature.(http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-basic/thumbsup.gif) (http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys.php)

One of the plasic card manufactures makes a small scall model R/Road 'clapboard' sheet; which works great as well.
: Re: funnel vents.
: gregk9 October 31, 2010, 16:07:30
Many thanks for the comments. I dare say that some manufacturer somewhere will produce a lot of things, useable by a lot of people, but i'm on a strict budget and simply cant afford much in the way of extras, so I personally make as much as I can out of bits I have in stock, plus by doing so, It also lets other members of the forum view what actually can be made from a bit of time and trouble. it adds to the challenge of the build in my books, just wait till I get to the stern anchor winches [ha ha].

I am currently desgining a lever operating mechanism to lower the bridge mast, as the cabin lowers down to the deck and vice versa. hopefully it will link up with the lift mechanism, but its still bits pinned on a board at the moment, but it will be posted on here in due course. I am 2 stages ahead in the build , as to whats on site, just to ensure all works 110% before it gets posted, even the mistakes get rectified, but not before posting them as well as i do prefer to post everything, that way others learn from mistakes too!
: Build pt 6 - rubbing strakes
: gregk9 November 01, 2010, 16:40:40
The original construction details, calls for some 6mm square rubber strips, to be glued vertically to the pusher post faces [for obvious reasons]. But thinking a little further, why not put something similar along the sides of the hull? Especially to help protect both the thin plastic hull sides, but the paintwork too??
So, how to attach such, without it peeling off at the first nudge against the pool edge i ask myself.
Well, On a lot of boats the rubbing strake appears to sit inside a channel fixed to the hull side plates.  Ok, so how to do same?

I decided to attach 2 parallel 3mm thick plastic strips, horizontally along the hull sides, about 20mm above the waterline, so the rubber is not permanently immersed in water, but also at a heaight where it would be of assistance, when nudging barges and other vessels in due course of its called duties.

Square rubber eh?  yep, I thought about that too, well you can either source from a model supplier who deals with gliders, as its often used as a launching item, or if you want some thicker stuff, i went for a hunting shop, as they sell square profile rubber, for catapaults and managed to get some beefy 7mm square rubber, sold by the metre and reasonable priced too!


The pics below show the plastic rubbing strip guides in place, as once the rubber is bonded in, the glue will hold on 3 faces, to give better security, whereas originally, it would of only had glue on the back edge, against the hull!
: Build pt 7 - Elevating bridge.
: gregk9 November 02, 2010, 11:15:35
Well, i finally think I've cracked this one! It took some time to finalise all the linkage, but after some bench testing, all seems well in the docks.
To cut out all the scissor lifting beams and pivots was challenging enough, but I wanted the mast behind the cabin to raise/lower, at the same time as the bride section itself and not by using yet another servo or radio channel.
So after checking out the scissor links that elevate the bridge, I chose to link a bar off the centre pivot bar, run through a slot in the wheelhouse floor, and then link to a lever arm, I had already  glued to the mast pivot.
  Things seemed to work ok, but could not get full lift on the bridge mechanism, so added a "slotted link bar" to the system, to allow for the additional movement of the bridge, so now both lift to max height and lower accordingly too.

I have ordered a metal geared "hi torque" servo to operate this little lot, so once that is installed, i will upload a video of the mechanism too, so you will have to do with pictures for now, but hopefully, they should give you the ideas behind the headscratching !
: Build pt8 wheelhouse ladder
: gregk9 November 11, 2010, 15:22:25
I have left the wheelhouse for the moment, to construct the wheelhouse ladder, which also raises/lowers as the wheelhouse does so. It is only connected by a pivot point on the rear walkway platform, but for full effext, it has to do so, otherwise the ladder will hand at a silly angle when the bridge deck is raised.

the plans are a bit vague for dimensions so you have to search for yourself, referring to both the main side view of the boat and the plan view for length and width of the ladder.
Construction is simplicity, 2 side frames of 1mm plasticard, 4mm deep, some 3mm diameter plastic tube and some brass rod to insert through the plastic tube, but I used plastic rod 0.75mm, as its far easier to bond to the side frames, and of course makes for a quicker build too.
I cut and drilled the side frames, following the plan to get all the rungs in correct position, dont forget to round the ends of the frames too. then after cutting the 3mm tubes to length, press through the 0.75mm rod through one side frame, through the roller and out through the other side frame before cutting to length, allowing about 1mm each side externally to the ladder side frames for glue bonding.
the lower bottom roller also has 2 6mm diameter, 5mm wide sleeves added, to act as wheel rollers for when the ladder moves in an arc across the deck to as the wheelhouse moves, so remember not to overtighten the brass bolts that hold the ladder to the back of the bridge too much.
: Re: ladder build pt8
: gregk9 November 11, 2010, 15:34:05
second picture attached below for reference
: pt9 - OPERATIONAL BRIDGE !
: gregk9 November 12, 2010, 06:43:33
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CwndJyguho
Finally recieved delivery of a metal geared servo, so have tried this as the drive motor form the elevating wheelhouse and mast.
All works fine, some minor adjustments were necesasary to get the link arm correct length on the servo, but other than that, IT WORKS !

I can now carry on with the internals of the wheelhouse, make up the rear cabinets and then see about hiding the wiring for the mast lights and radar motors.
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: mike_victoriabc November 12, 2010, 07:25:22
That looks pretty tricky - nice work!
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: tugs53 November 12, 2010, 07:47:19
Very nice work cool cool
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 November 12, 2010, 08:50:55
Thanks for your comments, I'm glad it all works after pondering over the mechanism for over 3 days in design stage [ha ha].
I just have a couple of deck lights to install on the rear wall of the wheelhouse, install the cabinets inside, then I can put the wheelhouse roof on, then see about setting up the servo mount on the underside of the deck structure, but thats a minor item from getting all those links to work correctly.
I do have to admit to really liking the 5th servo switch on my "Planet radio" system, it gives such a nice "speed" to the servo.
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: tugnut November 12, 2010, 12:42:31
Well done Greg works well good idea with mast :) :)

 John
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 November 12, 2010, 15:32:42
Ive seen a couple of build threads on this particular pusher tug, which is why I decided to try my own hand at one, but none of them had managed to get the mast to pivot "automatically". it was either fixed in place or held up by a removeable pin, which meant you had to dock the tug, pull out the pin, then re sails out with the mast lowered, Too much fiddling about for my books! Even the original plans in the magazine said to "insert pin in mast", to lock in upright position!
The radars again, are static in 2 other variants, one tried to use a rubber drive belt and pullies, but htis has a minute geared motor, inserted in to each radar box, they are pictured earlier in the build notes, but they will be posted as part of the build shortly, once they are attached to the walkway and operational. I am again using the copper sticky strip under the walkway to hide the electrical wiring as much as possible, plus you can overpaint over it, unlike standard wiring, no matter how thick the paint, a wire is still a wire. Not unless you then make conduits to run the wires in, but then you add more weight to the elevating bridge, which is something I have to be careful of, otherwise the servo motor will have to be replaced with a geared motor and possibly a chain drive mechanism [which I do have waiting in a box - as a backup if this servo fails].
no, i dont believe in just one method of doing something, i always try to have a contingency plan "just in case" [ha ha].
: Build pt 10 - radar masts & deck wiring
: gregk9 November 14, 2010, 07:03:02
I have now managed to insert the geared radar motors in to the resin castings, kindly supplied via MMB. I just had to drill a 6mm hole in the top of the motor box, to put the motor in, then drill a 3mm hole right the full length of the radar mast post, so i can run the wires through.
I then placed a piece of 100m plastic tube, to replicate the outer mast cylinder, on to the deck, drilled a small hole to take a winding handle and job complete.

I have now also run the copper foil strip on the underside of the deckhouse gangway, so I can easily attach the wires, to both the radar motors and the navigation ligth boxes, which will sit on the sides of the deck rails.
: Build pt11 - rear anchor winch.
: gregk9 November 19, 2010, 15:34:53
Whilst i am waiting for  some of the front wheelhouse items to set dry I decided to build the rear stern anchor winch gear.  these are affixed to the top of the rear access hatch, where the main switchgear and charging point for the drive batteries will be located. So, need to make this hatch easily removeable, but not too loose as it falls off.  So i decided to buy some small 2mm diameter magnets, 1.5mm tall, so very small, but super strong too! I drilled a 2mm hole in the hatch cover in each corner and then again in the centre of the longer sides, then after adding some 15mm wide coaming under the floor, which allows this hatch to sit flush with the deck, i drilled through, so I can align the lower "fixed" magnets with the one which will be bonded in to the removeable hatch cover. Once glue had dried, i tested this out and it worked a treat, it holds secure enough not to let the hatch cover bounce around, but with a gentle "tug" it lifts away readily.
Now to sort out the anchor winch, this was made up as per the plan drawings, but I used some thinner plasticard to bend over the radii of the winch drums to get a cleaner radius. I added some hydraulic pipes to the winch motor, made from some 2mm solder, as it was easier to bend than brass rod. Added the lower anchor guides and fitted the support brackets. Applied some paint to match the main upper deck structure and will just add the anchors and chains later once ive finished lifting off the rear hatch cover, but allowing some slack in the chain, to allow me to lift the cover to access the switches.
: Build pt12 - railings
: gregk9 December 01, 2010, 13:19:01
the railings have been a challenge/work of art in themselves. the original plans listed only single sided items for the upper deck gangways, leading to the elevating  bridge. this to be honest, didnt look right, so ive added a second set, the other side of the walkways.
the rails along the deck and upper gangways were made from 1.5mm brass rod, being the simplest to join and also harder wearing than plastic rod. I did however use plastic rod [2mm] around the elevating bridge, simply for its light weight, not wanting to overload the already hardworking metal geared servo that pulls it all skywards at the flick of a switch.
All I need now is the steady hand to paint off of the rails white, best wait now till daylight, save me missing an important bit out [ha ha].
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: tugs53 December 02, 2010, 19:11:41
Well Done Greg :) :) :)

Your posts are full of helpfull Tips....which is great :) :)
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 December 03, 2010, 03:39:44
Thanks for your comment, it is appreciated. i try my best to "fill in" where the simple plans leave a nasty gap in the instructions, so Once i've completed a section or built something thats "will work" then i update my build blogs, but gibve a bit more info fo anyone else who may consider a similar build, or  , better still be able to use some of my methods to help with similar projects of their own. yes I also do add some of my failures in as well, afterall, we all learn from mistakes too !
: Build pt 14
: gregk9 December 18, 2010, 07:49:15
So the boat continues, I have now managed to sort out the electrics for the winch motor, simply using 2 micro switches to swap polarity on the motor, to reverse direction of the motor, to either "winch in", or "winch out". This will enable me to hitch up to virtually any barge or other vessel, " for towing/pushing" purposes! [ha ha].
" for some time now, so think its about time I finally secures the roof of the bridge down and left it be. So that will be next job. I have affixed a couple of air horns to the sides of the wheelhouse roof, for effect and the added weight of the white metal fixings has nto caused any issues with the lift servo.
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: sea.mariner December 18, 2010, 08:07:22
Gregg,

I have been reading through this thread over past few days and can't thank you enough for the photos, tips and especially the time you have taken to type all the information. It is a stunning build with expert thoughts and ideas, also excellent detail.

Kind Regards, Dan.
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 December 18, 2010, 09:19:12
Thanks "sea mariner" for your words. I am enjoying the build, dont get me wrong, but like a lot of other plans/builds, the manufacturers, often leave some "grey areas" where its a little vague for the average moddler to comprehend. I am merely an amateur in model boats, Im onlty just coming up to the end of my first year in building and constructing them, so I'm far from being any expert. i try my utmost to explains all i do, so others can learn from my builds and, yes, from mistakes also.
photographs, with the era of digital photography, its little effort to upload them nowadays, the age of 35mm film was a different kettle of fish ! they were only used for postal stuff back then eh!
I like to photograph all aspects of my builds, no matter what it is, its simple enough to do, its just remembering to keep taking photo's whilst you are building something, thats the problem,, as i do get carried away sometimes in a particular item/stage and almost forget to take them.
But just as a "sampler" this is an actual photo of what stage its at now!
: Build pt15 - drivetrain.
: gregk9 December 19, 2010, 03:44:02
The instructions for this pusher tug "suggest" a pair of "380" type motors. Being a bit wary of the small size and torque, i decided to go a little bigger. I knew thats I was going to fit a pair of 6v batteries, purely to help disperse the weight of the batteries more evenly anyway, so a bit more torque in the hull would be too cumbersome, or drain the batteries too fast.
I managed to find a pair of motors [s/h] on ebay, they were of "unknown orogin", but labelled as 9-12 v, but had  some decent 6:1 epicyclic reduction gearboxes on the nose end, thus multiplying the torque output and reducing prop revs accordingly. I had already bought the kort's complete with 50mm propellers, a pair of brass tubed prop tubes with 5mm shafts. I did use the same length of shafts as per the plans, as with the motors i managed to obtain, they sit at quite a nice low angle, thus enabling the propellers to direct their thrust more evenly, than at a steeper angle in the water.
 I made up some motor mounts out of square section wood, the cooling coils were made from some brake pipe tubing, produced as an "aftermarket" things, if anyone wishes to replace the metal brake pipes on their cars - "diy jobbing" so to speak. But its very flexible, rolls round very easily, cheap  and readily available, plus a 1 mtr piece will easily make you 4 coils.
I appreciate that this pusher tug is not going to be travelling too fast in the water, so I may have to add a water pump to the circuit, but at least all the basic groundwork is in place and the pump will only need some flexi silicone pipes to connect inline if needed. its a "belt n braces" thing I added, when I finally get the barge built I want to push with it. not knowing what type of load it may put on the motors, I thought best to add the coils now, rather than a retrofit later on .
One thing to add here. I strayed from the original plans for the propeller supports. the plans called for a solid strip of plasticard, to bond the underside of the prop tube, to the hull, this seemed to be too flexible and I had difficulty keeping the propeller centrally in the kort tube, so i gave those up and fitted a pair of diagonal support bars to the propeller shaft tubes. thye nove gave me the rigid support to ensure the props dont flex or foul in the kort nozzels under load or on turns.
: Build pt16. bridge drive servo.
: gregk9 January 04, 2011, 08:36:09
As Ive mentioned previously, I have opted for a metal geared servo for now! I have bench tested this gear for a few hours to ensure it works ok and no problems with the load on the servo and operating gear.
So time to tell you my method of elevating the bridge.

I have tried to keep the bridge assembly as light as possible, especially as I have also geared the mast to raise/lower with it.
The driving servo is mounted to the underside of the upper superstructure, so when you lift off the upper body, all the mechanism goes with it, so no hassles having to disconnect anything other than the servo fly lead.
The servo mount was fabricated out of 1.5mm plasticard for strength and reinforced around with support ribs to prevent any flexing when the servo is under load.
I fabricated a plasticard servo arm, after a few attampts to get the length of the arm right for maximum lift/lower. So again, this will be something you personally will have to do, once your servo position is secured.
This was a big gap in the original instructions, they told you how to make the bridge raise/lower with arms and rods, but never showed any linkup to a servo or motor.

The picture also shows the cable runs for all the wheelhouse lights and deck illumination lamps.
Oh and the microswitch you can see visible, next to the servo arm, thats for the mast lights, so as the mast lowers, the lights are automatically switched off, so the lighst are not on with the mast in the down position, btu soon as the servo starts to lift the bridge, the mast starts to raise as well and the mast lights come on too.
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 January 11, 2011, 08:30:24
Just a short video clip of my Egrete pusher tug, virtually 99% complete, just waiting to locate a lifeboat dinghy for the upper deck, cant seem to find right size yet to fit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ifgGIdfHNrw
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 January 11, 2011, 08:32:26
The micro motors I sourced for the radar units work really well, they are powered off a 1.5v battery cell pack in the stern. no, before you ask, they are not adjustable in height, i had enough fun getting the bridge just right [ha ha].
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: Sudbury II January 11, 2011, 13:52:33
Very Impressive Greg!!

Suds
: In the water !
: gregk9 January 18, 2011, 08:33:24
My Egrete Pusher tug has had first contact with the water in our clubs pool at Chasewater!

I have to admit feeling very nervous, especially with its all plasticard construction, but my fears were soon put aside as the twin korts powered the boat away from the poolside and off away !

It handles very well, steers to perfection and Im glad I didnt spend out on a bow thruster, as it does not need it at all with the twin korts at the rear. it turns quickly and easily, even reverses in a straight line!

I am yet to add my newly build barge in front of it for a load test, but it managed to push a couple of overturned club members  boats to the shore without breaking in to a sweat.

Its a wonderful pusher tug Build. Id recommend anyone have a go at building and sailing one of these, they're great !

Suppose next task is to see actually how many barges I can get attached to the bows and still be able to drive and steer it.

Anyone got any multiple barges anywhere??? [ha ha].
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 March 05, 2011, 16:06:47
Just a few pictures taken to day of  my pusher tug.
: new pics !
: gregk9 March 05, 2011, 16:13:30
few more images
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: tugs53 March 05, 2011, 17:27:44
Man she sure looks good on the water!!

Well Done.
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 March 06, 2011, 01:53:44
many thanks for your comment. yes, im very pleased with the result too. Im even more pleased the scissor bridge, complete with the link to the wheelhouse mast works! Its terriffic to watch it all happen out on the water.

Yes, i know, it needs some barges to push now! [ha ha].  Hopefully, amidst building my "moorhen kit" i will get round to making a couple of barges and get this beut working for its living.
: Barge build.
: gregk9 March 16, 2011, 13:06:40
Ok, so decided id got sufficient styrene sheet in stock to build a barge, so have started with a basic rectangular hull. Added some triangular corner braces along the hull sides and corners. I added a double whammy of cross bars across the stern, being as this barge will be pushed for most of the time.  I will also add a front tow post, so my Sun tug wont get left out either, so barge can be towed too.
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: tugs53 March 16, 2011, 19:23:21
How big a barge Greg?
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 March 17, 2011, 05:38:03
If you exclude the "pointy add on bows" bit, its about the same size as the pusher tug itself, so 280mm x 620mm, height is about 120mm
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: tugs53 March 18, 2011, 18:24:27
Going to be quite the unit!!
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 March 19, 2011, 03:15:59
I hope it is !!

I kept the draft "shallow" for this barge, being as it is to be pushed along, rather than be towed. I have already built a more "sturdier" wooden barge with a deeper draft, which allowed for ballast, this pulls fine behind my Sun tug, but had to fill 3  x 2ltr plastic bottle to act as ballast, so the tow line between the two didgoing slack as the barge "caught up" so to speak.

I am aiming to take the egrete and barge along to my sailing pool this afternoon, so hopefully i will have a report and some pictures to follow later on.


I have made the stern of the barge 50mm deep, so hopefully this should be sufficient "contact area" to keep the barge square on and with the electric winches i can constantly adjust the tension on the tow lines, if they go slack.So hopefully the barge wont go off on its own course! ;D
: With barge !
: gregk9 March 19, 2011, 16:34:55
managed to get some pictures of my egrete tug with its new barge. have to say thats I soon managed to get used to handling the boat with the single barge on, perhaps we ought to now try for 2 barges, see how it performs then [ha ha].
: barge pictures
: gregk9 March 19, 2011, 16:37:09
Just a few more pictures for you
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: tugs53 March 19, 2011, 17:36:45
Nice job Greg!

You could be like the towboats on the inland rivers...with 6 or 8 barges.

Take a look at some of member 'towboatjoe's' pictures and videos!
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 February 05, 2013, 16:27:49
Just thought you might like to see my Egrete now with two barges. It still has plenty of pushing power, but wont be attempting three barges, I might get accused of hogging the sailing pool with the sheer length of my setup LOL.
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: russellward February 05, 2013, 21:34:08
What a beautiful job and what a lot of fun she must be to push your barges around! I am new to the thread but have had a scan of the pages.
Well done indeed. I have watched barges (mostly self propelled on the Rhine. I was amazed at the amount of traffic. Didn't notice any pusher tugs though.
NZ has a lot of rivers. Some were used for transport in the 1800s to the mid 1900s but nothing large. The Waikato was the most used river as far as I am aware. Its lower reaches were very lazy and there was a lot of farming in the area.
Thank you for your building log!
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 February 06, 2013, 07:08:26
Thanks for your reply and comments. The Egrete is a nice boat to build, especially for those model boaters who sank their teeth in modelling with plastic kits, as basically, this IS a plastic kit, built entirely of styrene sheet, cut to the drawings. Its superb to handle on the water, thanks to a pair of steerable korts at the stern. i did think about adding a bow thruster, but she dont need one.
I run a 12v 7ah/hr gel battery and it lasts for hours at a scale pushing speed.
The drawings and plastic sheet kit are still available and I would recommend one to anyone who prefers working in plastic.
: Re: Rine/Rhone Pusher tug "Egrete"
: gregk9 February 15, 2015, 09:18:39
Hi Guys,
Just as an update, this pusher tug is still sailing well, I cant fault it at all and would fully recommend it to anyone who is wary of a wood build, but prefers plastic to stick together. Done correctly and using the right plastic "weld" liquid glue, you wont have any leaks!
Best of luck if you do, or if you need any help, then just ask and I'll willingly assist with further info.