Tug Forum

Specialist Types Of Tug Boat => Steam Tugs => : thamestug October 26, 2013, 06:30:03

: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug October 26, 2013, 06:30:03
This winters build is going to be the Warrior class tug EMPIRE WOLD, built for the British Ministry of War Transport in 1941/42 by J R Crown and Sons Ltd of Sunderland. Not a lot of information is available about the vessel, as she left Reykjavik, Iceland on the 10-11-1944 to go to the aid of a torpedoed tanker and disappeared without trace along with her entire crew of about seventeen, thus giving her a life of under three years.[If interested the details can be found on the Thames Tugs site; Click on this link
    http://thamestugs.co.uk/MANAGED-TUGS.php. 
I have only ever seen two photos of the tug, plus a small plan of a warrior class tug in Bill Harvey’s excellent book about Empire Tugs. Obviously she will be built complete with gun tubs etc. Sixteen of the class were built by various yards and as with most war built vessels there were detail differences, mostly depending on the builder.
So to this end a mobile marine models hull [Lady Jan] was bought very cheaply [Not from MMM], advertised as having minor blemishes but only the washports cut out. For ‘cut out’ substitute’ hacked out’as they had been chain drilled very haphazardly and probably then levered out. Truing them up has resulted in them being slightly oversized, but I think I will claim that as a yard detail difference. Through the good offices of Brian at Mobile Marine, who was his usual very obliging self, I obtained his plan of the Lady Jan, which however shows some generic  peace time modifications so some time will have to be spent drawing in the gun tubs etc. The only other very slight problem with the hull was in the rivet detail which was very pointed and proud but a rub over with wet and dry has solved that problem and flattened the rivet heads off. I was going to attach a couple of piccies of the build but like a plonker left the hull with some parts glued and clamped up in a position inaccessible for photographing so ‘pictures to follow’.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: model tugman October 26, 2013, 07:05:29
Ooh I look forward to this one Pete good oh   cool  Geo
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug October 26, 2013, 08:03:30
Ooh I look forward to this one Pete good oh   cool  Geo

Thought you might like this one Geo but NO it wont be finished by the AGM!

The rudder skeg being a very vulnerable part is made from brass and bolted thru the keel with small BA screws and nuts.. A false wooden keel was fitted inside the hull to lift the securing nuts to a position where they could be got at to tighten them. Skeg to be faired in externally later. Second piccie shows the shaft and motor mount glassed in. The mount is removeable as the securing nuts are glassed in to the bottom of the ply mount. The screws only were covered with vaseline during this process and then run out before the fibreglass had fully hardened, cleaned up and refitted after everything hardened off. This same process was used with the skeg securing screws and nuts so that theoretically it could be removed if necessary, maybe to withdraw the rudder, but it would still be a major operation doing cosmetic damage. Lets not go there!!
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: TERRY October 26, 2013, 11:19:38
Hi Pete, That's an interesting subject for a model. Looking forward to your build photos.
Terry.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: Model Tug Man October 31, 2013, 06:05:19
Looking forward to your build, Pete. I will see if I have any pics in my library. Have you searched British Steam Tugs and 50 Years of Naval Tugs?

TM
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: tugnut October 31, 2013, 10:49:42
 ^-^ Pete looking forward To this one dont forget pictures.

John B
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: Model Tug Man November 01, 2013, 03:24:40
Checked my books and found a rather general plan and copies of the pictures you already have. Sorry there wasn't more. Good luck with the build.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug November 01, 2013, 07:43:09
Thanks guys. MTM No there is not a lot of info out there!!

Not a terrific lot of progress since last post. Have started making the rudder, Basically 3mm brass rod with separate 3mm pieces forming the main blade and the balance blade centres. These are sandwiched between two cheek pieces of 1.5mm ply. The 3mm ply pieces are notched on the edges against the rudder shaft and take a wire which passes through the shaft to prevent the shaft twisting in the rudder without turning it. After one cheek was glues on the shaft and wires were laid in position and the notches filled with filler. The other cheek glued on when dry. Started getting deck supports in and preparing template for the deck of 1.5mm ply. hope to get some more done over this weekend.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug November 05, 2013, 06:47:42
The rest of the deck bearers and steering servo bracket glued in and awaiting final sanding and first fit of deck. The second bearer back from the front will have the middle cut out once the deck is glued on. Next job after fairing off the bearers will be to get the rudder and tube in and see if I can think of anything else that needs to go in before the deck is fitted.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: TERRY November 05, 2013, 07:26:14
Hi Pete, Very nice neat work.
Terry.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug November 08, 2013, 04:19:15
Deck on and clamped down. Rudder and rudder linkage fitted. Tiller arm made out of pin from 13amp plug.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug November 09, 2013, 08:17:22
Deck now secured and clamps off. Got it on in one piece except for the very last section under the bandstand. Dont think i would have got the whole lot in one piece due to the tumblehome of the stern bulwarks and it needed to flex in two directions anyway. Would have been just my luck to spit it trying to 'fold' it in. Anway missing piece now clamped in and there will be a removeable hatch in it to get to the rudder head, all covered by a removeable bandstand. Got the final couple of bits of the rudder skeg cut out, faired and glued in as well this afternoon.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug November 17, 2013, 07:26:56
The unexpected arrival of a rare bows on piccie of another Crown built Warrior showed that there was some radical replanning to do regarding the front of the superstructure. This was not one width throughout but the fore section was only about the width of the wheelhouse above and then widened out around the boiler room and also was flat fronted with rounded corners. Some hurried redrawing resulted in mods shown. All this luckily before coamings were added. Pics show infilled deck areas at front of superstructure waiting to be filled and faired, removeable bandstand under construction and coamings going on and rough template of superstructure base just to see if I missed anything else!!!!!!.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: tugnut November 17, 2013, 07:43:46
Well spoted Pete, starting to take shape.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug November 24, 2013, 06:48:57
Decided to get deckhouse framed up, mainly so that I could get on with the woodwork before the weather closes down operations in the garage, and I would then have a smaller component to get on with indoors. Base screwed temporarily to deck to get the shape over the deck camber and built up from there, carefully removing any screws that look like being built over!!!
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug November 25, 2013, 08:43:02
Deck houses pretty well framed out now. A while now to clean everything up and blend the curves in. Still got a bit of framing to do at the upper front of the main deck house and then of course cladding. Jobs for the winter evenings in the kitchen!!![Especially as 'er indoors' is off to the US of A for a while]
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug December 02, 2013, 02:51:23
Got the cladding on the deckhouses now. Hopefully might get boat deck on before the xmas shutdown,
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: model tugman December 02, 2013, 07:53:15
Thats looking good Pete, well done :) :)
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug December 02, 2013, 08:30:44
Thanks Geo. Hope everything as good as can be expected with you and yours.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug December 08, 2013, 08:20:33
Got the deckhouse roof on and also the base for the wheelhouse so packing up now for Xmas to keep the domestic authorities happy!! Merry Xmas and Happy new year to all!!!
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: Lighterman December 10, 2013, 12:23:59
Nice work Pete!
Can you tell me when they fired that gun did it have the tea cups off the side and the compass need re swinging?
M
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug December 11, 2013, 01:57:08
Thanks M
Dont know about this one but did read somewhere that when they fired the fore gun on one of the early empires all the wheelhouse windows shattered, the recoil twisted a dent in the gun tub floor and the shell parted the forestay which is presumably why they then developed a sort of tripod mast. All that could be heard was the sound of drawing boards being dusted off!!!!
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug January 19, 2014, 06:12:34
Weather being reasonably kind temperature wise here at the moment [although i should think there is a good depth of water in the lake!!] have managed to clear out the workshop of the xmas overflow of garbage etc and get back to doing a bit. Wheelhouse assembled ready for finishing and funnel roughly positioned. All the other fittings have now arrived so if temperatures head south have plenty of winches and davits etc to assemble indoors.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: model tugman January 19, 2014, 10:09:06
Hi Pete. that is a lovely funnel, she is really taking shape, my new build is on our chantry website at the moment in the forum, in the work in progress section    ;)   Geo
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug January 20, 2014, 01:19:00
Hi Geo
I have to hold my hands up and say the funnel is not of my making. Its an MMM resin casting job and tho you cant really see it in the piccies is complete with plating detail. Was looking at your new un late last night. Another great job but looking at all those complex shapes i hope you are doing plenty of laying down in darkened rooms!!! Hope see you at AGM.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: the goon January 23, 2014, 21:05:47
Thamestug,

Lookin' really good  :)

Mark
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug February 08, 2014, 06:42:26
Have just got back on the model again after nearly three weeks of assembling lots of flat pack office furniture for my daughters new office. [stick to boat kits guys, they are much more accurately produced!!!]

Weather at the moment not really conducive to filling and painting what I had already started so ventured into unknown territory regarding the gun tub for the fore oerlikon.
Found a small plan of a warrior class in the empire tugs book and scaled up the gun tub on the computer until after several goes I thought it looked about right. Pics show it on a temporary mounting block.[the small plan and common sense i suppose seemed to indicate the floor of the tub should be about parallel with the water line so the boat had to be levelled off about right in the stand. The actual legs of the tub will need some consideration as the anchor winch is mounted at least partly below it so that will probably be assembled next to get some idea of leg angles etc. The pink card templates aft of the funnel will be the other gun tubs but may well need to be slightly larger.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: model tugman February 10, 2014, 11:28:19
 ^-^  Pete   OOOH we will have to behave now you have got guns, ^-^   ;) ;)
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug February 24, 2014, 07:47:24
Some of the fittings built during winter laid out now to see where we might be going with this build. All trial and error [especially] at the moment.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: model tugman February 24, 2014, 12:38:15
 ^-^  Pete   It's amazing the difference a few fittings make isn't it.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug February 25, 2014, 01:22:35
^-^  Pete   It's amazing the difference a few fittings make isn't it.

Hi Geo. Yes it sure does. With only the funnel on it the boat deck looked like the flight deck of a carrier. Now its suddenly shrunk!!. Hope see you soon at Bluewater

cheers Pete
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: Model Tug Man February 25, 2014, 04:12:39
Coming along nicely, sir.

 cool
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug March 14, 2014, 06:53:27
Thanks all for comments

Have now managed to get the bulwark gussets/knees made and fitted. [Does anybody else on this forum hate this job as much as i do? I absolutely detest it and when they are all fitted there always seems to be one that stand out like a sore thumb by being either wider or thinner than the rest. Or is it just me?]

Also managed to get the first sacrificial coat of primer on which shows up the blemishes to be fettled. Anyway it was a great day weather wise to be outside spraying.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: model tugman March 16, 2014, 06:18:04
Oh.  yes looking good Pete.   ;) ;)
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug March 17, 2014, 05:33:32
Thanks Geo
Managed to get the odd blemishes on the hull filled and rerubbed down over the weekend and the bottom of the hull painted this morning.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug April 09, 2014, 06:23:07
Hull painted; anchors fitted; front gun mount finished [except for canvas dodger]; some deck furniture painted and laid on. superstructure primed.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug April 20, 2014, 04:24:49
Got some detail on the superstructure and started on the funnel now
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug April 20, 2014, 04:26:03
The port coal bunker lifts out to give access to the on/off switch
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: model tugman April 20, 2014, 05:56:28
Hah a very neat idea Pierre.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug April 24, 2014, 06:11:47
Hah a very neat idea Pierre.


Thanks Geo. One of the better ideas I have had on this one!!

Funnel fitted and finished now; Mast in progress; one of the aft gun tubs fitted.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug April 30, 2014, 04:49:45
Bit more progress between bouts of raging hay fever.
Funnel stays made and fitted and dodgers fitted to two of the gun tubs. Wheelhouse next I would think.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: Model Tug Man April 30, 2014, 06:25:29
Nice job on those dodgers!!!
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: tugs53 May 01, 2014, 16:54:08
Very museum-like quality cool
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug May 06, 2014, 07:59:27
Thanks MTM and 53


Wheelhouse glazed and fitted out.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: Calimero May 06, 2014, 08:47:53
Nice !  :)
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: model tugman May 06, 2014, 10:35:19
making a nice job of her Pete   ;)
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug May 14, 2014, 04:35:28
Thanks fellas

First fit of some of the detailing to go on boat deck.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug May 16, 2014, 07:22:20
Port side of boat deck and monkeys island details now attached.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: model tugman May 16, 2014, 10:06:13
She is starting to look very busy now Peter.    cool
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: tugnut May 16, 2014, 10:22:43
VERY NEET,doing a good job Pete cool,will she be done for the 27th,
regards John
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug May 17, 2014, 03:33:23
Thanks guys

Pushing along as much as I can, but dunno about 27th. was originally looking at Ramsgate show but got on a bit faster, but off up the Baltic for a fortnight in a couple of weeks so only time will tell!!!
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug May 22, 2014, 06:57:46
Where it's at now and where it will probably stay for next three weeks until back off holiday. Everything forward of rear tow bar now attached. Still some details to make and be fitted and electrics, rigging etc.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug May 22, 2014, 07:09:53
One more from bow
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: model tugman May 22, 2014, 09:28:31
Looking very nice Pete,thought you might take it with you to pass away the time. angel angel
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug May 22, 2014, 22:50:54
Thanks Geo, if I thought I could get away with it i probably would take it and float it up the Kiel canal!!!!
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: Geoff C. June 13, 2014, 22:46:25
Hi there,  That's an excellent build,  I hope there are more pics,    I want to see how you've done the masts and rigging.   I'm building the Cervia as the Empire Raymond in grey livery with plank on frame hull.   Hope there's more to come.   Best regards,  Geoff.

: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug June 23, 2014, 07:51:33
Thanks for all comments

Back on the  build following holiday. Steering chain covers made and fitted, rope cradle made and foremast well on way.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: model tugman June 23, 2014, 10:03:59
Very nice work Pete,won't be long now.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug June 24, 2014, 02:57:18
Thanks Geo. Love the XVII very nice job. I suppose if I get fed up with the navy grey later i can rebuild Wold as Napia!!
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: Model Tug Man June 24, 2014, 03:37:08
Looking like a proper ship, sir. Nice work.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug June 27, 2014, 04:21:42
Thanks MTM
Some more detail on now. Tripod mast stays, Anchor Davit, Mizzen mast [temporarily rigged for painting], Fire main and monitor. [I know technically these should all be grey but used a bit of modellers licence just to give the model a bit of a 'lift'], fore stovepipe, tow bar over capstan. Few more odd details to make and put on and then looking at rigging and electrics.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug June 29, 2014, 04:07:38
Name boards now on and rear roller and gog pins.
The empire tugs appeared to carry no permanent names or ports of registration during WW2, especially when at sea or on coastal towing. No doubt to starve the enemy of routing info etc. However when in port they seemed to adopt various forms of temporary bolt on or 'slide into brackets' name boards, some abbreviated to EMP. ----- or even E. -------. These were fitted in a variety of places, deck house sides, bridge wings, even monkey island railings.
I had a PM and rough sketch from a guy involved with the tugs about the stern roller and removeable gog pins. [apparenly also called mollygoggers.] These were fitted to a number of the Empire tugs involved in sea and coastal towing as there were reputedly some close shaves when gog ropes werent used or broke and the tow line slid round the bulwarks towards the midships of the tug putting it into a capsizing situation if using a long heavy wire. The roller assisted in the recovery of a long broken tow wire when using the rear capstan.
The screw head in the rear platform, which is removeable to get to the rudder arm and linkage will eventually be covered by a convenient coil of rope.
One more day I think of detailing and then onto rigging.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug July 04, 2014, 06:27:05
Rigging completed this week and details just about finished.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug July 06, 2014, 02:11:13
Afloat for the first time in the domestic test tank today for initial ballasting.
the hull and deck plus motor weighs in at about 8lbs.
the main superstructure weight 4.5lbs

to get more or less down to the waterline took 8lbs of 12v12ah battery
3.25 lbs of metal in the forepeak
4.5lbs of metal aft.

as the pics show there is still a little bit to go especially astern for final trimming after the control gear is fitted.
total weight at the moment about 28.5lbs so may make the ballast removeable as the old back is not getting any stronger!!!
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug July 06, 2014, 02:14:27
Some shots showing access to the motor and battery etc with superstructure and engine casing removed.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug July 11, 2014, 03:08:54
Battery, ESC, RX and other electrics now fitted and tested OK
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: model tugman July 11, 2014, 05:23:56
 ^-^  Looking good Pete, not long before sea trials then?    Geo
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug July 11, 2014, 07:29:37
Thanks Geo and all others. Its finished [I think] apart from last trimming of ballast.

My tribute to the 17 crew of the Empire Wold and all the other seamen who have no known grave other than the icy waters of the North Atlantic. RIP and thank you all.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug July 11, 2014, 07:31:16
A few more
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug July 11, 2014, 07:32:11
Last one until sea trials
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: tugboyben July 11, 2014, 09:16:16
Hi thames
Fantastic build i have been watching your build can wait to see it on the water

I have a mountfleet cruiser hull in the shed i would love to build a tug like your's useing that hull 

Jason
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: model tugman July 11, 2014, 10:28:43
Looking forward to seeing her afloat now Pete, I hope to have sea trials next Wed on the XVII, be nice to see them both afloat,   Geo
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug July 13, 2014, 02:32:40
Thanks Jason

Geo I have got wednesday pencilled in!!!!
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: Model Tug Man July 14, 2014, 10:19:24
Great looking tug, very nice work.

Hope she's a floater!!!

 :D
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug July 15, 2014, 05:34:44
Thanks MTM

I now know she's a floater from the bath test now it remains to be seen if she is a go-er!!!
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: sea monkey July 15, 2014, 22:54:34
Great job, you'd have to be pretty pleased with that one.
Steve
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug July 16, 2014, 04:31:53
Thanks steve

well pleased following trials on the lake today. Everything working ok, trim about right, in the water for over two and half hours and bone dry.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: tugboyben July 16, 2014, 07:59:38
 ^-^ thames

Your tug looks super  cool on the water well done thank's for shearing  the build with the member's

Jason
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: Model Tug Man July 17, 2014, 10:06:29
A proud captain and rightly so. She looks great afloat.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug August 14, 2015, 07:41:06
short and shaky video here

http://youtu.be/3RKev3LR5jE
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug April 14, 2017, 05:05:50
Never was that happy with the all over wartime grey finish on Wold but couldnt authentically do much about it so have now decided to modify it a bit to look as though she has hd several rough convoys, just to break the grey up a bit. Long way to go but started on the hull.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: tugboyben April 14, 2017, 06:38:48
Hi thamestug
Great job i like to see mucky tug's
Picture of a mate of mine built on a mobilemarinemodels hull can't rember which

Jason
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug April 15, 2017, 07:28:15
Got a bit of weathering done on the main deckhouse today. A tleast i can see what has been done!!
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug April 20, 2017, 07:29:17
Just about finished just a few bits of tidying up to do once the paint has dried for a couple of days.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug April 20, 2017, 07:31:16
A couple more pics
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: sea monkey April 20, 2017, 18:31:11
Wow, that turned out great, Peter.
Did you do all the weathering with a brush or airbrush?
Steve
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug April 21, 2017, 05:13:28
Thanks Steve. A combination of methods. Most of the rust was done with an airbrush. In one or two places I overdid this but when dry I cut it back with a wet stiff back sponge with some washing up liquid on it. The superstructure and bunker tops were done with brush using very watery paint. The wheelhouse was also done by this method. No rust here as they were wooden wheelhouses. Some of the other 'smears' were done with very dry brush. Some paint also applied with cocktail stick along seams etc and the dribble from the pipes on the funnel. The 'clag' on the funnel cap was a thick mixture of black paint and talcum powder applied with a brush. The canvas dodger around monkeys island was dirtied first and then painted with a thick mixture of salt and water. When thoroughly dry the odd lumps will be brushed off but already in certain lights it sparkles as though encrusted with salt!! Can never make my mind up whether the air brush bits are worth the trouble given all the hassle of getting the paint mix right and all the washing out after and also they  seem very prone to clogging with acrylic paints.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: thamestug May 08, 2017, 05:23:53
Pic of her afloat after several hard convoys. Photo courtesy Model Tugman.
: Re: EMPIRE WOLD build
: Kev30 May 08, 2017, 07:44:34
Yeah that looks just the job with the rust effect, very nicely finished.

Regards
Kevin